Tabernacle, Second Coming and other discussions

Discussion:
Q: Why is the description so detailed for how to build the tabernacle by God
A: Oral detailed description vs blue prints is one answer. A thousand words instead of a picture (blueprint).
A2: There are correlation between materials and placement and cultural symbols and references.
A3: A foreshadowing of Christ

Discussion:
Was Mary Magdalene a prostitute?
A: Nope
Luke 8 v2
Wiki Reference

Discussion:
Second Coming and millennial Reign
Post; Pre; A : Millennial --- This recorder is confused
This is what I thought I hear... I still could have wrong if I am then fix it
in your write in responses to this blog.

Pre -> Rapture of church prior to the judgment going into the Millennial
Post -> We get better towards the period of the Millennial
A -> Set in the hearts of Christians for a Millennial

What is the mechanism by which we will know the second coming is breaking.
Voice of God? Trumpets? Heavenly sign?

Discussion:
Random:

Crusader Comics Cool series part of Dales Youth remembrances.

Bible Vs referenced during this meeting
Philippians 2 v6

Kenosis -> When God becomes man.

Light -> Source migration from physics to God.

Discussion:
What fetuses are able to perceive in terms of color in the womb.

Discussion:
Keeping the Sabbath, Points of discussion...

• Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath
  
• We are always in the Sabbath as Christ has fulfilled the Sabbath
  
• We are living out in His rest, the rest of the seventh day which times we are in.
  

Dealing with sin, what is the condition of sin in our lives in heaven?

Discussion: Sin and Temptation in Heaven
Will we be tempted by sin in heaven?
When we get to heaven we are made in God's image. Sin will die away with our earthly body and what remains is that which in the likeness of God minus the sin nature perfected in the light and power and in the spirit of God. We will receive a new heart a heart after God's heart.

Discussion: A scary encounter between Moses and The Lord

22 Then say to Pharaoh, 'This is what the LORD says: Israel is my firstborn son, 23 and I told you, "Let my son go, so he may worship me." But you refused to let him go; so I will kill your firstborn son.' "

24 At a lodging place on the way, the LORD met Moses and was about to kill him. 25 But Zipporah took a flint knife, cut off her son's foreskin and touched Moses' feet with it."Surely you are a bridegroom of blood to me," she said. 26 So the LORD let him alone. (At that time she said "bridegroom of blood," referring to circumcision.)

Discussion: Ambassador for Christ

Investigating our witness in the world as Christians. Various stories and where we have failed and fail repeatedly. Stories where hilarious and mortifying.

True prayer is asking to shine the light into the dark recesses of our being and reveal what needs addressing.

Discussion: Suicide and eternal security

Will a Christian who commits Suicide still receive eternal rest? Our consensus is YES. Although strongly and adamantly discouraged.

If Satan can get you to believe that God doesn't accept you he can render you an ineffectual.

When you have your security in heaven your attitude should be that you would wish to be in heaven unafraid of death, but in the midst of that, you want to remain earth bound, and be of use for building the kingdom.

Isaiah and beyond

Discussion: Book of Isaiah
Lots of prophases about current times and end times and meshes them together. How their is a lack of chronology that in Isaiah chronology was not the focus.

Revisionists would say that Isaiah was three different collections. Traditionalists would disagree. It is suggested that Isaiah may have put these together at the end of his life as he probably had a scribe that chronicled his works over his life and they were collected and recorded as a cohesive work.

Passage discussion: Isaha 20:1 2 at that time the LORD spoke through Isaiah son of Amoz. He said to him, "Take off the sackcloth from your body and the sandals from your feet." And he did so, going around stripped and barefoot.

- Prince of peace VS I have not come to bring peace but to set one family member against another discussion. Peace and turmoil in creation.

- Isaiah's prophesy about the future of king Cyrus
- Cyrus's Cylinder was discussed releases the nation of Israel from Babylonian captivity.

- Dead Sea scrolls giving us a measure of the faithfulness of recording of the book of Isaiah.

- The book of Isaiah meant to be read 200 years after his death as the fruition of many prophecies would be realized.

Chronology of the Koran was discussed and reference to the Hadith. Hadith being the sayings and traditions of Mohammad.

Discussion: of Ancient land masses and their religions, leaders, and influences.
Personalities:
- Diocletian (nasty dude)
- Constantine
- Alexander
- Mohammad
- Miller Lights? err Millerites

Discussion: about Prophases:
How often they are relevant for the times and the future. They can be recognized at the time as a prophesy or may not be recognized till their future relevance comes forth.

Some discussion of the Revelation, and apocryphal prophesies.
- Prosecution of the church from many different angles

Egypt -> Egyptians -> Romans -> Ottoman Empire

What happens to Hosea's wife? The prostitute.

Discussion: about the Christian life, carrying your cross, being a disciple. Making his will your will.
- Witnessing stories.
- Suffering the persecutions because we know what the prize is.

Discussion: A seeming discrepancy of the 4 gospels regarding the chronology of the recruitment of the disciples. Andy resolves this question.

Discussion: Peters Letters: His letters are written in very bad greek.
He was rough but had a great heart and was a rock. Wow how he polished up!

How do we know if the persecution we face is because we are doing things right? or wrong?

Whitney had the question of how do we know if persecution is reinforcement for doing the right things i.e. John 15:18 when Jesus says, "If they persecuted me they will persecute you also." VS. How we do know when we are persecuted because we are being disciplined for doing the wrong things i.e. Revelation 2:5 where Jesus says, "If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place," or again in verse 16 he says "Repent, therefore! Otherwise I will soon come to you and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth!" He also says flat out in verse 19 "Those whom I love I rebuke and discipline."

So we can stand assured we will face persecution in our lives. Whether it be persecution from the world because they hated Jesus first therefore they will hate us, OR God will allow persecution to happen to the church that's misbehaving in order to teach it a lesson or see which way it turns. Question is, how do we know which of the two we are facing?

We didn't discuss this for very long so please feel free to comment and answer better. But what we came up with was that God isn't going to punish you without letting you know why. He's going to send a prophet or reveal certain wisdom to the person or group that he's disciplining. Just as a Father isn't going to slap his child on the wrist and NOT tell them why, our Heavenly Father isn't going to let us suffer without revealing to us WHY he's doing that, we just have to be willing to ask him and listen to the answer. Similarly if a church that is doing all the right things and is pacing persecution BECAUSE of it, God will encourage and assure them.

What do you think?

How does a Christian know they're saved?

This week's conversation centered mostly on salvation. The question that I brought fourth is how does a Christian really know they are saved?
The Bible tells us salvation requires only two simple things: "[1]That if you confess with your mouth, 'Jesus is Lord,' and [2]believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved." (Romans 10:9) But this sounds easier than it really is, at least for me. What does it really mean to "believe with your heart?" In other words, how can you be sure believe something from the core of your being vs. being book-smart, and knowing all of the facts about something? If we really believe, shouldn't we be able to "move mountains," and perform miracles just as Jesus did? But I've never healed anyone, cast out demons, or raised someone from the dead, much less moved a mountain (at least not that I've seen). So how can I be sure I believe? Also, I don't feel that my faith has really been put to the test. Thank God, I've lived a blessed life, and I haven't yet been put in a situation where all other factors have been stripped away, and I had to rely solely on my faith to get me through. So again, how can I be sure I even have it?



In our meeting we discussed what it means to believe and be saved. John mentioned that even Satan believed in Jesus, so it seems it's not your belief by itself that will save you. If we know and confesses that God exists but we don't love him, we are missing the point altogether. We need to love God. After all the first and greatest commandment is to "love the Lord with all your heart, mind and soul." The question was posed "how do you know you love your boyfriend? Your mother? A friend?" If we love someone, we are going to show it outwardly, we are going to act like we do. If I love my friend I will respect her, and I'm probably going to do the things she asks me to do (and be happy to help her)! I'm also going to make an effort to work on that relationship, because no relationship is perfect. There will be ups and downs, and if there is love, there will be forgiveness, honesty and trust. Our loving relationship with God should be no different. We should be happy to do the things He asks us to do, and we should be continually communicating and working on our relationship with Him. We should be honest, and be trusting of one another.



So one good way to know if we really believe is to look at the way we act. If we love God, it should come as second nature to follow his instructions, and to seek him out. Are we thirsty for his guidance and teaching? Are we desperate for a closer relationship and walk with him? And while the evidence of fruit in our lives isn't proof of salvation, it is a good indicator of whether or not the Spirit is dwelling in us. Are we loving our neighbors as ourselves? Are we producing the fruits of the spirit such as love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control?


We also had a brief discussion on "Romans Road." This is a collection of verses Romans, that will help a Christian understand what it means to be saved. It expands on the two simple requirements given in Romans 10:9 mentioned earlier. Romans road begins with Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
In other words, we all have sin in our hearts, and were born under sin's control.
--So step 1 is to be able to admit that you are a sinner.

Next is Romans 6:23A "...The wages of sin is death..."
This means that sin has an ending, always resulting in death. We all face physical death, which is a result of our fallen nature. But a worse death is spiritual death that alienates us from God, and will last for all eternity. The Bible teaches that there is a place called the Lake of Fire where lost people will be in torment forever. It is the place where people who are spiritually dead will remain.
--So step 2 is understanding that we all deserve death for our sin.

Next is Romans 6:23B "...But the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
We learn that salvation is a free gift from God to you! There's nothing you can do to earn this gift, but you must reach out and receive it.
--So step 3 is ask God to forgive you and save you.

Then comes Romans 5:8, "God demonstrates His own love for us, in that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us!"
Here we see that when Jesus died on the cross He paid sin's penalty. When He took all the sins of the world on Himself on the cross, He bought us out of slavery to sin and death! The only condition is that we believe in Him and what He has done for us, understanding that we are now joined with Him, and that He is our life. He did all this because He loved us and gave Himself for us!
--So step 4 is to give your life to God... His love poured out in Jesus on the cross is your only hope to have forgiveness and change. His love bought you out of being a slave to sin, His love is what you have to accept in order to have the benefits of everlasting life with him. God loves you! So it's only natural that we should love him back by giving up our lives to him!

Next is Romans 10:13 "Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved!"
We can't rely on our own efforts to get us through life, we must rely on the Lord. He knows everything, He's our loving Father and wants what's best for us. Therefore it just makes sense to ask him to guide us rather than blindly leading ourselves.
--So we see that step 5 is to rely on and pray to God in Jesus' name.

Finally we have Romans 10:9,10 "...If you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Jesus from the dead, you shall be saved; for with the heart man believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation." As discussed before, it is of utmost importance that we not only believe that Christ died for our sins, was resurrected and still lives in heaven, but we MUST profess this with our mouths! If we truly believe that Jesus' blood is life giving and represents his love for us, then we need to share it with others!
--So step 6 is if you feel God knocking on your heart's door, invite him in and let him dwell in you. Accept his gift to you! Cherish your relationship and tell others about what he's done! Our salvation is secured.